Not necessary in Umerca because the dumbed down masses give it away and the NSA has already locked it down with the help of gooooogle/da book o da face and co for everyone's 'security and convenience'.
Just had my identity stolen. Someone made an account with Verizon and bought a new phone under my name and with my credit. Honestly wouldn't mind if the US had more stringent laws about opening up a new cell phone account. Pretty ridiculous what someone can do with such a small amount of personal info
In Malta, you can get SIM cards from places like newsagents without any need to say who you are or to show any ID. But if you buy SIM cards directly from the mobile phone service providers you need to show ID. I think that buying SIM cards without any ID is something that is going to be stopped soon.
China is a dystopian nightmare in real life. All countries appear headed in the wrong direction regarding freedom, despite it being safer now than literally every other time in history. We should be relaxing, not desperately sacrificing freedom for safety from a largely imaginary set of enemies.
Yeah, but the feller I replied to was talking in quite a different vein, also, started off with nation-states and moved on to individual people in the next sentence. It ain't the brightest idea to equate the motives of people with that of a nation-state.
Especially oppressive, single-party ones.
I don't want it to seem like I am making excuses for China, but as a foreigner entering the US you must have your "picture taken"...
I think we can all agree that most of the world is a dystopian nightmare in real life by now..
I don't think that the tracking itself is the issue, I think the issue lies with data gathering (in both these cases, facial data) and tying that data up with a person (and/or a phone number). In both these cases you have to way to escape (part of) your biometrics ending up being in a national database.
Having European and USA technology brands it amazes that people continue to buy their smartphones from a totalitarian state like China and help them to spread out their totalitarian influence around the World.
Buying from China is not that different to buying from North Korea, even Kim Jong Un relies on China for support.
So it's 2 choices then. The CCP version of totalitarianism or the NSA version. I'm opting out of both, but hey if you like the illusionary 'freedom' version, don't let me hold you back. At least the people living under the CCP version of totalitarianism KNOW they live under totalitarianism.
You have to buy from totalitarian country when there is no other choice because the alternative product is far worse, but this is not the case with smartphones, spec differences in between smartphone brands are really small.
I was in mainland China last year for about 3 months. In order to get a SIM / phone number a passport was required. I also noticed all "free wifi" hotspots (eg. at Starbucks) required a text verification to my phone number (I assume to attach my wifi browsing habits to my SIM / passport). It's deliberately difficult to browse with privacy.
That's just a starbucks thing. Most place does not require text verification as well. Basically starbucks is trying to make sure not too many people are freely using their services. Many shops or stores will have something like 1 hour limitation for 1 phone number.
I heard though that if you arrive in China with a US-based SIM card and roam on Chinese networks, that you get pretty similar access as if you're at home, ie, the Great Firewall does not block the normal US-based sites.
If that's true, I'm curious how a no-logs VPN provider would fare in that mix as well.
Yeah roaming works fine but it's fucking expensive. I have a decent international plan with unlimited data in EU, NA, HK and a bunch of other countries but even that is £6/mb in mainland China. Much cheaper to just get a lifetime VPN license and hop on WiFi.
If that were the case then why wouldn’t chinese citizens buy prepaid sims from the U.S. or other carriers that allow international roaming?
Edit: I meant in the sense of not needing to give up personal details to get the sim activated in the first place.
The only advantage would be the great firewall circumvention but that's doable with a VPN. Otherwise they would exchange privacy compromise by China for privacy compromise by the US.
Also, if most of your friends use WeChat, you are going to use WeChat too no matter the network. It's the same for people in the rest of the world, social pressure makes us all use non privacy respecting services (the few that remain).
Like the rest of the world, it's a convenience Vs privacy tradeoff.
If by privacy you mean not provide ID, that's doable with other methods (HK simcard being one as said above). But you will still be routing your traffic through China, use Chinese services due to social pressure, etc.
It always depends on your threat model however It's so much easier to get a VPN for Great Firewall circumvention. If you need to be really private (e.g. if you are an activist of sorts) then you need to examine your threat model independently.
It's much easier to remain private in China than people think.
Before I switch to a Chinese telecom that gave me internet in China, I'd just either rent a wifi egg (more expensive) or get Sim cards off Taobao (Chinese Amazon). Never needed to show ID. Wifi egg you're limited by location. Sim card can be shipped anywhere and shared. Downside with Sim cards is they expire even if unused. I've never had to activate my sim card with any ID (I did a quick Google and some websites say you need to activate prepaid sims but it hasn't been true for me).
Couldn't be more obvious you are not well travelled lmao. Quality of life in any T3+ Chinese city is pretty dam high if you are not broke, privacy concerns aside. I'd rather live in Shanghai than 95%+ of US cities.
Yeh I'd much rather live is some bum-fuck flyover state in a trailor so I don't have to scan my face for a simcard! A much better quality of life! Privacy is obviously not the biggest factor in life quality for almost all people - look up any QoL metric. Privacy is important to us if we are on this sub, but realistically it doesn't outweigh everything else in life or you would be living in a bunker faraday cage off the grid to maximise your life quality lmfao
Where did I say average person is living like that? It's an extreme example of how more privacy =/= greater quality of life, that's all... And all I was saying is if you have a decent job in a major Chinese city the quality of life is actually very good, but that is likely true in most places with reasonable healthcare, developed infrastructure and low crime.
Wait, we are still talking about China, right?
The country that ranked 52nd out of 65 for healthcare according to people that have actually lived and worked in multiple countries?
The country that's the single largest polluter on the planet and as recently as 2012 had _a million people per year_ dying just from air pollution?
The country with the most heavy-handed surveillance and propaganda apparatus in the developed world? The one that's known for jailing and straight-up murdering protestors and dissidents?
The country with literal concentration camps and forced organ harvesting from prisoners?
But yeah, they have "free public healthcare" and probably more public transit access in their 3 biggest cities than the average US city. Nevermind that their HDI is over 25% lower than the US.
I'm sure quality of life is *way* better in China. /s
My friend FewStretch,
Humans have survived under different environments,each being difficult in their own way.
India, like every country has its problems, which get resolved eventually, like all contradictions albeit at a slow pace.
Population is not the controlling aspect that make a country worst. I try and enjoy the diversity the population provides me. Many people do the same, some complain much to their anguish. We humans breed at a huge pace. India will/or has reached a point where the population rate decreases, as seen throughout Europe. (Please correct me if I'm wrong)
Countries that are the most powerful, such as America, Russia, China, India and a gaggle of other nations, that steal the money of people tax,denying rights etcetc are definitely the most corrupted of the lot. By that definition of corrupt, would not the most powerful country in the world be the most unpleasant to live? Do you suggest India is the most powerful country in the world?
\> India, like every country has its problems, which get resolved eventually,
All countries don't have the same problems. All countries don't have problems of the severity. All problems don't get resolved eventually.
\> Do you suggest India is the most powerful country in the world?
\> Population is not the controlling aspect that make a country worst.
I suggest that you like non sequiturs.
>All countries don't have the same problems. All countries don't have problems of the severity. All problems don't get resolved eventually.
Every country has different problems they have to deal with.
Problem, meaning contradictions get resolved eventually,since it's origin is within the human mind.
Do you think problems like Terrorism, lack of privacy etcetc will continue over the years?
>I suggest that you like non sequiturs.
Had to Google this word.
The original comment mentioned India being one of the worst countries, meaning corrupt, bad or evil.
Does power not corrupt?
Who is the most powerful country?
The original comment, also mentioned population. Population, though unpleasant for many will eventually be stable, and people will adapt to it. The problems caused as an aside, like lack of cleanliness, hygiene etcetc, are not directly affected by population, though population can be taken as one factor.
What's really worrying is how close to this many Western countries already seem to be. You can't even open a mobile phone service account in Australia without providing your passport, drivers' license or other government ID...
...we also have a national facial recognition database using photographs required for the issue of such ID. So not *quite* the same, but potentially exactly the same result. *And* we have mandatory data retention requiring telcos to retain all metatdata relating to your use of said phone number.
Thinking about the facial recognition database gives me an anxiety attack. I wish that was hyperbole, but when I think about it (and the implications) for too long, I *literally* (yeah, I said it) get hit with an anxiety attack. This country is moving in some very uncomfortable directions.
It's not just your country. It feels like the whole world is moving in that same uncomfortable direction. It just happens that the ones with murdoch owned press outlets being influential are moving faster than the other democracies.
For years already in China you needed to present the government ID card to get a sim card - the face scans now are an extension to ensure the person applying actually matches the ID. China is rightfully condemned for a lot of shit but this isn't really much worse than the number of nanny state governments which need ID for internet/phone plans.
Yes, you can, but to actually be able to use it, you must register it with Government ID. Say you bought a Telstra prepaid SIM, you insert the SIM, you open a browser, and then you get redirected a page on Telstra's website where you provide your ID. It gives you your phone number on that page too.
Yeah fairly sure you can anonymously grab prepaid Sims. And afaik there are no laws requiring ID.
I imagine the main telcos require it so they can chase up bills easily. Smaller telcos I have no idea what they require. I suspect you don't need ID for the small ones but not entirely sure.
In New Zealand you can buy a pre-pay SIM card for maybe a dollar (or get them free with a new phone) and you definitely don't have to register it.
Hopefully that kind of basic privacy continues here... But face scans in China? Doesn't surprise me at all.
Ya the SIM card difference between countries is crazy. In Cairo, Egypt I waited over an hour in line to register and fill out forms with passport as ID and in Melbourne, Australia I got a sim out of a vending machine at the airport.
In india you have to give all personal details as well, not to mention the govt. Has the fingerprint of all the citizens and the telecoms have been linked to those .
Can't believe europe hasn't followed suite on orwellian future
We don't have a serious problem of cybercrime here, so there's no point. If we were to be doing that, the government will be spending millions to cut down maybe a couple hundreds worth crimes. Not worthy.
* "1.2 MILLION DUTCH FELL VICTIM TO CYBERCRIME LAST YEAR (2018)" https://nltimes.nl/2019/07/17/12-million-dutch-fell-victim-cybercrime-last-year
The official Dutch study / report is here: https://www.cbs.nl/nl-nl/publicatie/2019/29/digitale-veiligheid-criminaliteit-2018
Unfortunately it's only in Dutch (no English version). .so I can't really say whether or not it estimates cost/financial-impact.
Sure,.. but the cost is still there.
* "We don't have a serious problem of cybercrime..."
* "..spending Millions to cut down maybe a couple hundred worth crimes"
.. are really factually wrong statements.
The Netherlands does have Cybercrime,. so much so they've created a special Task Force to handle it and published their 1st report last year.
The 1st link I provided is in English. And yes, I did read it. And yes, it does say that 1.2 Million Dutch fell victim to cybercrime last year. So the attitude of "it's not a problem" and "maybe a couple hundred worth crimes"... is indeed factually wrong.
The policy varies a lot among countries, even in EU: https://prepaid-data-sim-card.fandom.com/wiki/Registration_Policies_Per_Country
Also sometimes it's not a clear yes/no, but you can use it e.g. for some time before registration is needed. The table says "yes" for Germany, but I remember that before roaming was forced to be free in EU I purchased the SIM, put some random things at online registration and it worked. Might have changed.
Must be nice. I had to show ID to get some damn sudafed. I understand that they're doing it to cut down on illicit drug manufacturing but I still got an uneasy feeling about how 1984esque the whole thing seemed.
*edit* Just realized I replied to the wrong comment, and Sudafed is pseudoephedephrine, but I'll just leave it here. Also, this was in the US.
In some countries it lasts already pretty long time.
Here is a list of countries saying which needs and which doesn't need registration: https://prepaid-data-sim-card.fandom.com/wiki/Registration_Policies_Per_Country
Note that some countries are still a bit special, like Colombia, where you can use non-registered SIM for 30 days I think. It's meant for tourists.
Yeah, this one was on here several times. And it's also the case in many other countries. E.g. in Germany you have to identify with your ID card via webcam or in a post office when registering a new SIM card. You identity will be permanently linked to that SIM card.
No it doesn't. This is a new law from 2017. Buy a new prepaid card and try to register it. It won't be possible without identifying.
Some small shops might still have some pre-registered cards but they're expensive and I don't know about if selling those is even legal.
Only for prepaid, because you can buy them anonymously for cash.
With contract SIM cards, the assumption is, that you are paying them with a bank transfer, credit card, paypal or a similar service and you can be identified through these services.
And you will be tracked by cellphone towers and wifi networks 24/7. The average person need Google to install apps. All your internet and call activity are tracked. The company which made your phone are tracking you. You will never be anonym for authorities.
German article with a helful map for some European countries. This law and practice is in place since July 2017. Unfortunately I can't find an english news article about this.
Like most other surveillance measures it's supposed to prevent terrorism - at least that's the reasoning from the government.