RT @brucefenton: Rep Tlaib is proposing to make two coins worth $50 each & say they are worth $1 trillion each.
Then for our government to have the mint create artificial money on a computer and use that to buy the coins from ourselves.
Seriously. That’s the actual plan. https://t.co/mA1eSEUfsw
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Ah yes the sneaky trillion dollar coin Obama has planned to use. (He did’t for obvious Publicity reasons) Basically it allows the government to spend more money without causing mass inflation. It was really only a possible plan because the senate wouldn’t raise the deficit despite doing to for decades
I adore Rashida Tlaib. Easily my favorite from the Squad.
Anything like this she proposes has less than zero chance of passing. McConnell would probably take a photo negative of the bill and then pass that just to spite Democrats, so we'd owe a new $1000 a month to the government, but her heart is overwhelmingly in the right place. I just hope she gets to accomplish something someday.
Means-testing while the economy is cratering is not only silly, but cruel and destructive. Trying to prop up a beaucracy to enforce abitrary rules as we spiral towards a depression is terrible policy.
We need as much stimulus in the economy as we can get right now. This is the worst possible moment for trying to figure out who should and should not be included.
Workers will be falling through the cracks of any means-test before their paperwork is completed by a government caseworker to see if they are eligible for money.
Start giving everyone 2k a month, and do it last week.
There is no real stimulus we can apply to the economy. That economy is gone. Think about it:
* How many new cars will be sold this month and next month?
* How many restaurants will be open?
* How many flights, hotel bookings?
* Who is going to buy new clothing if they aren't going anywhere?
* Who is going to buy gasoline if they aren't going anywhere?
* And so on.
There is no stimulating your economy when the problem you are up against is biological and not economic in nature. Stimulus is for when the biological threat abates. Until then, we're more or less consigned to a subsistence economy.
Save everyone -medically and economically- that we possibly can. Then take up the economics when that is done.
Yes, but giving people like me money right now is a waste. I don't need it (but wouldn't mind it, of course). I won't spend it on anything useful to the economy at this point. What am I going to spend it on, anyway? Everything is closed except for necessary business. And I'm sure as hell not going out under these conditions.
In all likelihood I'll sit on it -and so will many others in similar positions. Deflation is likely. By holding that $1k now, I can increase it's purchasing power to $1500, maybe $2000 later on. So, I'm adding to the problem rather than fixing anything and I'm not being helped in any fashion.
We still can be generous enough in our means-testing to make sure that very, very few are left behind. But there's no point in giving people money right now who are stable and can't really spend it anyway. (I can't believe I'm arguing against getting free money!)
Cut me a check later when we need to prime the pump. I absolutely promise to spend every penny and more so that my neighbors can go back to work and get on with their lives again.
Yeah no shit you don’t need a check right now. Maybe you could pay it the fuck forward to one of the MILLIONS of folks who just lost their fucking jobs. Give to a restaurant that was just mandated to close up and fire everyone to save lives because of the presidents gross incompetence.
I’m going to paste what I had previously written regarding universal vs means testing.
The biggest challenge with means testing is bureaucracy - people are required to jump through hoops and the policy itself is more open to attack by nuance.
For instance, say you propose $1k per month for all those making $75k or less annually. But some say $75k isn’t the same in NYC as in the rural Midwest or South. Okay that’s fair so now we apply CoL adjustment factors to the $1k base and spend a long time arguing which factor to apply to which city/region. Is Manhattan all one factor even though Inglewood is drastically different than Financial District? But you eventually get it “right” and move on.
Well now others say that’s not fair because you have people with a million or two in the market that lose $20k from their portfolios, are retired, but just choose to realize $60k in capita gains on last year’s tax return. Whereas people making just over $75k to barely get by without any type of large savings / net worth get nothing.
Okay so now you make it sliding scale and try to test via net worth. Well the markets are crashing and net worth is volatile by the hour.
So while you spend months arguing over this society is experiencing 25% unemployment rates due to a shelter in place order which was quick to pass. And we haven’t even gotten around to implementation of said means-testing.
Universal policies are quicker to distribute and many can make the argument the speed at which helps arrives for those in need offset the $1k Bill Gates would simply ignore in his mailbox. You might also not need Universal Healthcare but that doesn’t preclude Justin Tradeau or Queen Elizabeth from it. Buffet may not need social security but he’s getting forced distributions paid into his bank at his age.
TLDR: The speed at which universality helps the needy overrides the harm/waste in cutting checks to the fraction of Americans who will sit on it.
I guess we disagree on what constitutes effectiveness in this situation.
I think effective is defined by addressing the different needs of this crisis in the order in which it makes sense. Make sure everyone who needs money to survive (and a few who don't) survive. Later addressing the economic collapse that is the product of the pandemic.
Your method ensures that everyone who needs money gets it now and vast numbers who do not. And at the end, we'll still have the economic collapse to deal with. We will spend a good deal more money and achieve no real benefit through this method, imo.
So we are supposed to go through all this rigamorale to avoid conservative welfare queen fears to arrive at "effective", meanwhile, "effective" is subject to hard real-time constraints where the amount needed at any given moment is going to go up to make up for wasted time.
Just fucking donate it to Meals on Wheels or something. If even a fraction of a percent of the citizenry are left behind, that's still thousands of people.
Thousands of people being failed because we were afraid of giving a well off person money that can be donated or taxed back.
Thousands of people who may not be able to pay their rent or feed themselves and their families.
People's lives are on the line dude not just because of the virus, but because of the economic impact of it.
So what I want the government to do is stop bullshitting with the tinkering and means-testing, and just fucking help people as fast as possible.
Edit: Means-Testing, not means
Only now, if we had mandatory paid sick leave the US GOVT. could of foot this bill for 100th of the cost.
If we had the preparation and tests available we could have managed this for less than a fucking F22
If they just said we will cover the salary for anyone who has symptoms and tests positive. We could have had a million people lie and it would have been cheaper.
While I agree with this I don’t see how this would make things less expensive. If businesses have no revenue they have no way to pay sick pay and shutter even earlier than they would have else-wise.
Mandatory sick time would have done little to combat the financial disaster of the situation.
Obama had H1N1 under control for $9B because he acted immediately.
States weren’t shutting down. Supermarkets functioned normally. Basics like toilet paper didn’t disappear.
This chaos we’re seeing now? This is all Trump. Chaos is his bread and butter. And this is what his voters voted for. They wanted this. Never forget.
Yes, the response to covid19 had been completely and utterly botched and the majority of the world governments should be ashamed. But the comparison to h1n1 is pretty poor, this is many times more serious.
Trump supporters compare this to H1N1 all day long — they love to point at the figure of 12k deaths in the US and blame Obama for it.
The number of deaths from Covid-19 is likely going to be at least ten times that amount, and it _will be_ Trump’s fault.
Try 100 times that. **Minimum.** 1.2 million Americans dead. In Italy death rate is currently sitting at [9% of confirmed cases](https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/italy/). A [CDC estimate](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/03/cdcs-worst-case-coronavirus-model-210m-infected-1-7m-dead.html) stated that, on the low end, 160 million people in the US could contract the virus. 1.2 million dead in America would be less than 1% death rate. So if Italy's 9% death rate is the worst case scenario, we are talking about 14 million Americans dead, which is more than **1,000 times** your number! We pray for the best, but this is a catastrophe.
This it’s what many don’t get. Like their Loan idea, I’m like what waitress making $3.00 an hour will be a able to pay that back in years smh. It’s good to see at least some have heads on their shoulders. Leadership should be learning from them on both sides.